defender of truth

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Posts by defender of truth

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  32

  Suffering and existence of God

  by elbib in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  many people find it difficult to reconcile suffering and existence of god.

  it seems they feel that it is god’s obligation to shield humans from ill-effects of their short-sighted acts..

  people’s hobby has something to do with this kind of reasoning!

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  defender of truth

  elbib 11 hours ago

  Dear defenderoftruth,

  I can try answering to your question why animals suffer.

  Let us first take an overall picture. Bible itself says all (including animals) were vegetarians to start with.

  ... How long this perfect situation remained we do not know, but what we do know is that it was a perfect start. Then some of the humans turn hunters (Genesis 10:9) This upsets the perfect environment where some of the animals too turn hunters. Please note, man set the pattern first and animals just followed humans.

  @Elbib

  Where is the evidence for this? Animals were not changed to carnivores after man started hunting.
  

  There were carnivores roaming the earth long before Eden.

  Carnivores existed before mankind.
  

  Predators existed for at least thousands, if not millions, of years before humans. Evidence for an omnivore or carnivore diet comes from examining body shape, teeth, fossilised stomach contents and coprolites (faeces). Whilst Watchtower may disagree on the million year ages given for these fossils, there is no doubt from where they exist in rock strata levels that they predate humans by lengthy periods of time.
  

  Following evidence from the fossil record show ancient carnivores in the act of consuming other animals...
  

  www.jwfacts.com/watchtower/animals-vegetarian.php
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  32

  Suffering and existence of God

  by elbib in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  many people find it difficult to reconcile suffering and existence of god.

  it seems they feel that it is god’s obligation to shield humans from ill-effects of their short-sighted acts..

  people’s hobby has something to do with this kind of reasoning!

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  defender of truth

  @Elbib

  Many people find it difficult to reconcile suffering and existence of God. It seems they feel that it is God’s obligation to shield humans from ill-effects of their short-sighted acts.
  

  I do see your point here. Humans often do cause problems for themselves and others.

  This is especially true if you believe in Adam and Eve spreading sin, suffering and death to all of mankind.

  One question, though:

  Why would a loving God design a world where animals suffer and die due to natural causes, as well as suffering caused by the predator/prey relationships that go back millions of years?

  Animals did not sin. Animals have suffered, due to natural causes and predation, long before Adam and Eve supposedly existed.

  Animals have suffered, either because:

  a) Life evolved in this way, there is no loving Creator God, and that is just the way it is.

  or

  b) God designed things in this way, suffering was part of his plan from the beginning.

  Elbib, what are your thoughts on this?

  -----

  For anyone else reading this, here is a good article on Jwfacts.

  www.jwfacts.com/watchtower/blog/animals-suffering.php
  
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  754

  Theists, why does God allow suffering..

  by The Quiet One in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  ..specifically, the suffering of animals.

  you can talk about free will/sin/people choosing to not listen to god etc to explain human suffering being allowed.. but how can you love a god that allows animals, that haven't sinned or chosen to not have anything to do with god, to have their short lives ended in often long, drawn out, painful ways.

  i could list stories i've read that would probably make you feel ill, but i'm not looking to shock anyone or start an emotional debate.

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  defender of truth

  www.jwfacts.com/watchtower/blog/animals-vegetarian.php
  www.jwfacts.com/watchtower/blog/animals-suffering.php
  If you have any thoughts or feedback, please send it to Jwfacts.
  
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  4

  Child safety in the UK

  by usualusername1 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  hehi was at a function this evening and was chatting to the assistant of the ceo of the biggest charity for child safety in the uk.

  i spoke about safeguarding and the huge investigation currently going on.

  the gentleman is a member of some heavy weight committees on child safety.

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  defender of truth

  Have you spoken to the ceo yet?

  Here are a couple of links you could share.

  https://www.revealnews.org/blog/in-england-more-accusations-that-jehovahs-witnesses-hid-sex-abuse/

  http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/585773/Jehovah-s-Witness-ordered-pay-more-700k-child-sex-abuse-victim-UK-first
  
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  4

  Child safety in the UK

  by usualusername1 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  hehi was at a function this evening and was chatting to the assistant of the ceo of the biggest charity for child safety in the uk.

  i spoke about safeguarding and the huge investigation currently going on.

  the gentleman is a member of some heavy weight committees on child safety.

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  defender of truth

  I am not sure that Cedars would be the best person to refer this gentleman to..

  I would quite strongly recommend asking him to contact either Barbara Anderson or Paul Grundy (jwfacts).

  Barbara really knows her stuff, and also Paul Grundy worked with the ARC regarding this issue.

  Here are their contact details:
  

  http://watchtowerdocuments.org/contact-barbara/

  http://jwfacts.mobi/contact-me/

  In the meantime, maybe you could send him this link? (Jehovah's witnesses ARC case, evidence and findings).

  www.childabuseroyalcommission.gov.au/case-study/636f01a5-50db-4b59-a35e-a24ae07fb0ad/case-study-29,-july-2015,-sydney.aspx

  Please keep us updated, if you are able to.
  
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  22

  When a crime is commited?

  by Drifting Away in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  i responded to someone on another thread, but would love to know this answer.. if a victim adult or child goes to elders and claims they were abused, don't they have to have clergy confidentiality?

  so i was told that they encourage the victim to contact authorities , and they contact bethel, but arent there hands tied if the victim does not want to go to authorities?

  an elder made the comment to me once.

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  defender of truth

  UK:
  

  www.lawandreligionuk.com/2013/07/23/articles-8-9-and-the-seal-of-the-confessional-are-communications-between-clergy-and-penitents-privileged/

  Australia:

  Vincent Toole, head of the church's Watchtower Bible and Tract Society, told the commission he would seek independent legal advice about the church's obligations to report child sex abuse to the authorities.

  Justice McClellan asked Mr Toole if he understood there was a general obligation for every citizen to report crimes to the authorities.

  "Coming to this commission has been a wake-up call for me, I can assure you," Mr Toole said.

  http://m.smh.com.au/nsw/royal-commission-jehovahs-witnesses-to-review-approach-to-sex-abuse-allegations-20150805-gis2fh.html
  

  Delaware:

  www.revealnews.org/blog/jehovahs-fight-law-requiring-child-sex-abuse-be-reported-to-police/
  
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  20

  Newbie

  by Ryan in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  hi, only just joined.

  going through a rough time at the moment and maybe this could help.

  any body around 27 year old age.

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  defender of truth

  Hello Ryan.

  Unfortunately I can't really help you, except to point to these two links.

  We started in 2006 as a group for xJWs in Kent, we then expanded into South East England, then the whole of England, and now we operate as a group for xJWs in the whole of Britain (England, Scotland and Wales) to meet and receive support and friendship.

  Please keep in mind that this group is public to anyone who joins and as we know, the Jehovah's Witnesses operate a shunning policy on anyone who disobeys the Watchtower organisation. So if you are a fader or a doubter and fear that there may be repercussions of your joining such a group, please do not use your real name, your face photo or any other information that may incriminate you or cause you to be seen as an apostate.

  People have suffered a lot because of the shunning of family members, the mishandling of child abuse cases, the mishandling of domestic abuse cases, the ban on certain medical treatments involving blood and the stigmatising of higher education as the pursuit of materialism and a waste of time. We are here to offer a listening ear and to reignite your social life and meet new people who understand you.

  http://www.meetup.com/xjwengland/
  

  Also, you may want to post the info in your opening post again, on this thread:

  www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/197364/ex-jw-uk?page=37

  Take care. :)
  
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  28

  Overlapping gen teaching- Help?

  by raven in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  hi friends,.

  can someone please help explain to me the overlapping generations teaching?

  i have not been able to grasp this one or what it even applies to?

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  defender of truth

  I wrote this as a step by step guide for Jehovah's Witnesses, to help show clearly that Jesus was talking about the generation of his day.

  Just by using the bible and a few quotes from non-watchtower commentaries.

  www.jehovahs-witness.com/topic/466140002/matthew-24-this-generation-if-you-jehovahs-witness-that-dares-study-bible-itself
  
• 
  754

  Theists, why does God allow suffering..

  by The Quiet One in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  ..specifically, the suffering of animals.

  you can talk about free will/sin/people choosing to not listen to god etc to explain human suffering being allowed.. but how can you love a god that allows animals, that haven't sinned or chosen to not have anything to do with god, to have their short lives ended in often long, drawn out, painful ways.

  i could list stories i've read that would probably make you feel ill, but i'm not looking to shock anyone or start an emotional debate.

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  defender of truth

  animals inherited death through Adam
  

  www.bbc.co.uk/earth/story/20141202-what-was-earths-first-predator
  
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  17

  Frank Otuo is he a con man or are we to support him.

  by joe134cd in

  1. watchtower
  2. scandals

  a couple of things first: .

  -nothing would bring me more pleasure than seeing wt getting stung in a costly law suite.. - please forgive me but i have only briefly read the court documents.

  so this brings me to my question.

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  defender of truth

  Just to add, by the phrase "been destroyed", I was under the impression you meant that the fraud accusation was proven unfounded, not that the actual letter of accusation had been destroyed.

  I said in my post:

  The only piece of evidence that there was ever so much as an accusation of fraud by another party, has been allegedly 'destroyed'
  

  Seems clear to me, but then I have a do have a strange way of thinking. ;)

  I have said all I can. The links and details are there to see, on this thread and the other.

  Sorry if I have caused offense or anything.